Labor Talks: Pierce Clears The Air

– For labor updates, follow: @daldridgetnt | @AschNBA

HANG TIME HEADQUARTERS – No offense to Billy Hunter or Derek Fisher, the two men who have been the public faces of the players’ side of the NBA lockout for months now.

But Paul Pierce is the man most of us have wanted to hear from in recent weeks. His name has been tossed about as some sort of rebel in this entire process, the one veteran star brave enough/crazy enough to push for decertification when few others had the gumption to go there.

Pierce has been portrayed as some sort of modern-day NBA version of Robert Roy McGregor and one of the main culprits in the process reaching its breaking point last week with the disbanding of the union and the filing of multiple federal lawsuits. But how you view him is all about perspective, and which side of this argument you are sitting on.

As often seems the case, Pierce’s role has been greatly exaggerated in some respects and probably not given enough credence in others. My main man Marc J. Spears of Yahoo! Sports caught up with Pierce after a charity game Saturday night and the Celtics’ captain and star clears the air on several outstanding issues. It’s always much better to hear it straight from the source (and not an anonymous one) whether or not the rest of us should get our hopes up about the possibility of a 2011-12 season being played:

“I’m optimistic that we will have a season,” Pierce told Yahoo! Sports by phone Saturday. “People ask me that every day when I leave the house if we are going to have a season. I’ve been probably saying, ‘Hopefully in a couple weeks,’ the last two months. That’s how optimistic I am. I just feel like something is going to happen.

“There is going to be something that turns the light on for both sides and gets this thing going. I think there is too much at stake for both sides. The [popularity] that the game is building nationally and worldwide … it’s crazy that we are at this place right now.”

Pierce doesn’t downplay his role in the whole disclaimer/decertification movement on the players’ side. And from what he told Spears he absolutely was the driving force behind informing his fellow players about their options regarding that course of action.

He also made clear that serious decertification talks arose after concerns about the foundation of the union’s leadership (Hunter and Fisher) came into question a few weeks ago, though he did acknowledge that it is something many agents have been pushing for all along:

“A lot of players saw that and were frustrated just seeing that stuff at the top was going on. Then they started asking me what was going on. All I did was I had an opportunity to talk to a lawyer a lot about decertification. And then I offered it to the players who wanted to hear what the guy had to say. A lot of guys were interested in talking to the lawyer so we had a conference call with like 40-something guys where we went through the ins and outs of decertification, the positives and negatives.

“At that point, players got to make a decision whether to negotiate or decertify or do what we’re doing now [disbanding the union and filing an antitrust suit]. That’s pretty much what it was. … I don’t know if I was leading the charge. If I was, I’d probably have the [decertification] petitions in my hand. I just wanted the guys to get the information. There were a lot of guys who were really critical of decertifying because they didn’t believe that the NBA would negotiate a deal with us.”

In a wide-ranging Q & A with Spears, Pierce elaborates on a number of topics, including his efforts to help educate some of his peers on the process (this is his second time around. He is one of 33 active players that lived through the previous lockout). And while he certainly doesn’t seem interested in the “nuclear winter” NBA Commissioner David Stern talked about last week, Pierce has a sober perspective on where things stand right now:

Q: In fighting for the best deal, are you comfortable losing the season?

Pierce: “I’m never comfortable with losing a season. I’m a part of a group that is taking a stand for something. Regardless of about how 400 players feel, at the end of the day we have to go all in or nothing. Regardless of what we do, we have to stick together. There are probably not a lot of players feeling [good about] suing the NBA. But this is what’s going on, this is what has to take place and this is where we are. So the players have to swallow that pill and hope for the best.”

Q: Are you considering playing overseas during the lockout?

Pierce: “I’m actually starting to think so. I love the game so much. I’ve been just sitting here at home playing against the same guys in pickup every day. I’m a competitive player, and I love being on the court. If the NBA cancels the season I’m definitely looking at my options and considering going overseas.”

“Right now, I’m just looking at my options. I figure we are going to run out [of time around] Christmas if we are not even close yet. Well, maybe before Christmas. If around mid-December, if we are not even close, that’s probably a time where I’ll make some major decision.”

***

146 Comments

  1. flowerpot says:

    To those who don’t feel that the players should be earning their current salaries: Where would you suggest the money go? These salaries are calculated, at least in part, on the potential money the player will generate. The money has to go somewhere. But thoughout the lockout I cannot recall the owners complaining about player salaries, there are some issues but salary is not one of them.

  2. Laker Fan says:

    So let me get this straight. The NBA players what their guaranteed $multi-million contracts averaging $5mil / year AND the want 51.5% (now, after their recent 57%) of the NBA revenues on top of that. Hmmm. I can’t think of another business in the world that operates (successfully) like that. The owners take all of the risk and end up with 43% of the revenues and have to pay the players salaries on top of that plus all other expenses. That sounds pretty absurd to me!

    Look, I love the NBA and basketball is the one sport I’ve watched any opportunity I get. But, these players are completely spoiled and out of their minds. While the make multi-millions, ticket prices go through the sky for the rest of us who are struggling to make ends meet. Nobody in their right mind can justify the players’ demands. While I’m disappointed the season has been put off (perhaps entirely), I have no problem telling the players to pound sand. They’re a bunch of spoiled brats that deserve to lose their Rolls Royces and Farari’s so they can return to the real world.

    One last thing, did these players or anyone here consider giving anything back to the fans for all we’ve provided them? No. Ticket prices will be the same and probably higher next year so only the corporate world can afford tickets and the average fan is priced out.

    Hey players! KMA!! Hope the league reduces your share to zero % and you’ll have to live on your $5mill annual contracts only and perhaps save a couple bucks for your future. That should be tough with your measily pay you’re complaining about.

    Screw them!

  3. maggie Magennis says:

    Everytime I see their logo, I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. NBA CARES. Who were they trying to kid. They only care about themselves!!!!

  4. Tom says:

    It’s not the players. I’m tired of hearing dumb people say “they make 30 times more than most Americans they are sooooooo greedy.” when in their shoes you’d be doing the same thing. and they don’t want more money, they already have less money, they want a far amount of money. it’s the business they’re in.

    if someone gave you a ring and asked you to sell it and they will pay you, you call people, ask people, finally sell the ring for $300.00 then that person only gives you $1.00 for selling the ring. after you put in the work and all they did was hand you the ring. this is the same thing. are the players suppose to work 24-7 365, and make 1 million while they make someone 300 million? why can’t that person make 290 million and pay the player 11 million. so really now guys who’s being greedy?

    There’s a lot more to it but the players are only trying to create a fair share. and check out some of the restrictions the owners want. they want to put restrictions on contracts that would make it so players can’t leave the teams they’re drafted to.

  5. Stephen from Australia says:

    I love basketball. I have been an NBA fan since Larry Bird came into the league. I think history can teach us all a valuable lesson here. When the NBA first started owners invested a lot of money and took a lot of risks; they deserve a return on that investment, the risks of which weren’t shared by the players. How many players mortgaged their house to get the NBA up and running?
    Players are getting paid a motza to do what they love. Not many people are paid those $$$ to do something they love. And remember, it is VOLUNTARY. The early pros did it for nearly nothing. Now the average player can make enough in a short career to live on forever (if he invests wisely). 40 years worth of income for 10 years work; doing something you love and which you CHOSE to do. If you don’t like being a multi-millionaire on those terms then go get a real job. There are thousands of able-bodied athletes I am sure would be willing to step into your shoes for a 50-50 split of the NBA’s profits.
    I have seen many employers exploit their staff. A 50-50 split of profits, where the risk is 100-0, is NOT exploitation.
    For me, I am getting my basketball fix by watching dvd’s of the 1980′s play offs and College hoops.
    NBA players, I respect your athleticism and skills. But it is time for you to take stock of what you have; an opportunity to make a lifetime’s worth of income in a relatively short period of time, be grateful for that opportunity.
    Who would like to see the remainder of the NBA season played with replacement players, like the NFL did in the Keanu Reeves movie?

  6. Jimmy Green says:

    You go to work tomorrow morning and ask your boss for 50% of what he/she earns and see what he/she says!! Its the same scenario as this lockout

  7. Jimmy Green says:

    It seems to me that they are a bunch spoiled little rich kids who have thrown their doll out their pram when they don’t get what they want. Why don’t us fans go on strike?Then they will be complaining when they get no income what so ever!! We have to earn our money just to watch basketball and they get paid to play it, they should consider themselves honored and privileged to be in the position there in!!

  8. virgil says:

    What happened to the phrase “For the love of the game”. the players are upset because they want more money even tho they are taking money from the people who really need. The people who work near and in the arenas. These 1000s of people will have to find new jobs which obviously won’t be easy and the players can just sit on their pile of money until this is settled. This my friends is complete BS!!!!!

  9. Shawn Thompson says:

    I think Sterns should be fired. His disrespect of the process and arrogance period, not just in this instance, but in other respects have bothered me for some time. I think he thinks he is God. Why not replace Sterns and see if a settlement can’t be reached?

  10. michael says:

    they had 2 years to get a deal done. irresponsible on Billy Hunter’s side for acting like this wasn’t going to happen.

    screw the nba and all the players. they don’t deserve a “fair deal”, what they get is enough. this is capitalism people. thankfully the college season has already begun, so no need for the nba until the end of march.

  11. jay says:

    poeple that say the players are making too much and are whining are just jealous and envious of the players! pure and simple! first of all it’s a lockout and not a “strike”! This is the only time the players have a right to voice their concerns, DURING NEGOTIATIONS! You can’t complain and whine after you agree to a deal. Do the math people and see that from 57% to 50% is approximately 1 BILLION DOLLARS! that is what the have a greed to give back to the owners, who let me remind you are the very produnct generating the money! For example if the owner sells their team (Charlotte bobcats) the team is pretty much the same because of the players on the roster, When LeBron left cleveland they went from being one of the top teams to being a bottom feeding lottery team! ONE Single player! Google the teams net value pre and post lebron and see if the players are the ones who are generating the money! And this is America and everyone is entitled to make as much money as they can (including the owners)! And that is what negotiations are for! And let me add…If you are not a teacher, a veteran, a fireman or a paramedic…then you too are over paid!!! it’s all relative! and if you are it is your own fault because you agreed took the job at that pay rate! you should tried to negotiate for more pay before you took it, which is what the players are doing! last thing is, if you are not going to watch anymore then DON”T! you have that right. @ GARRRY, i hate to break it to you but even baseball has survived without you watching, since you think so highly of yourself!!! it’s entertainment people! only you know how much watching the game means to you. if the tickets are not worth it to you, then you should just watch the games on tv. they are not worth it to me either, that’s why i only go to about 2 games per year! Let the owners and players handle their “BUSINESS” cause it is a business people. when the players put on their suits and go into the meeting with the owners they are now business men, not players!

  12. Brandt says:

    Is it really worth going to court and throwing away a season? And paychecks? I hope court settles this thing quickly, but there really isnt any winner here.

  13. a former fan says:

    that guy gary is nuts..

    • rich says:

      He is probably an NBA player (or related to one) that’s been mis-managing his millions that he can’t live a full year with anything less than a million. That’s just sad. What these players need are not only their agents. Each one of them needs a good financial adviser to help make them realize that a year’s worth of their salary is 15 or even 30 years worth of most americans !

  14. Christopher Murphy says:

    I am a big fan of the NBA. Fans are not going anywhere, trust me. I really would like to see a more competitive league. At the same time, I really feel the players. Once THATdeal is agreed upon, that’s it. Owners offered very little! They offered to take away alot. The game has grown tremendously in the last ten 10 years. Internationally as well. It’s the players that help do this.If they could rectify the balance of the league without taking away so much, they could get a deal done. Saying that is alot easier than it sounds though. But I’m with the players on this one.

  15. Tommohawk says:

    It’s about revenue splitting within the league, not about revenue splitting between players and the people trying to find medical cures. For goodness sake, grow up or take your irrelevant views to Riki Lake, I’m sure you’ll find a 5 minute home there!

  16. pete says:

    This is BS r freakin kidding me everyone is complaining talking about the players are greedy what about the rookies who make squat or the veterans what if someone tried to take ur money u work for u would feel the same way.If the owners would make better decisions about who they get on their teams or spend the money to get decent players then we wouldnt have had the decision.or Melo going to my Knicks they didnt do it for more money they did it to win in fact Lebron Bosh and Wade took less money to play together.The league is crazy and y should I boycott the game I love hope the season hurries up

  17. Andrew says:

    Got to laugh at the people trying to compare this situation with a regular job or company. Because let’s face it if the average guy (like me) decided to quit his job now there would probably be hundreds of thousands of people around the world capable of filling my position. If Lebron or Kobe decide to pack it in where are the owners supposed to find people who can fill their shoes? Top athletes have far greater market value than your average employee due to how exceptionally talented they are. More so in basketball where you need to be freakishly sized as well as freakishly talented, hard working, etc.

  18. weezy says:

    First of all half of you have no idea what you are talking about but yet you all take the time to make yourself’ look very un-educated. Without the fans it wouldn’t be no players, without the players there wouldn’t be no NBA. That is the players job, their life….What they do isn’t easy. Its called ENTERTAINMENT. Most of them have college degrees and high accomplishments. They are the ones that sacrifice night in and night out. There is no way that the owners should be making 280million more dollars a year in revenue when the players is the ones that the fans come to see in the first place.

  19. LERON says:

    I think the NBA and the players are making a horrible mistake at the right moment. As we see a bad economy unfold and thousands upon thousands occupy wall street and the rest of the country, the NBA should have took advantage of this time and play for the poor and support the 99% of America looking for work. This is a time when the NBA could have been pillars in the community all around the country. This is a time where the NBA could have calmed the country down with hard work and community service. Where are the Muhommad Ali’s, where are the activist in sports who play for the people and not the dollar. Whatever the case is these guys make tons of money they should take this time when the country is in a bad condition and fight for it through your fame and basketball talents. Will a NBA player stand up with these thoughts, I know one out of the 400 or so has to have these thoughts.

  20. Brain32 says:

    Now let’s see what are owners doing with their money.
    This is an informative site, here’s Jordan’s precious: http://hoopshype.com/salaries/charlotte.htm

    Seems to me that while players are good at playing basketball, some owners are freakin’ awsome at wasting their money.
    Now that you see Bobcats salaries, keep in mind that my favourite “new era” player – Derrick Rose and this year’s MVP does not even make 7 milions$. In the same time Jordan finds it ok to give equal or more than that to 4 players on his team that can’t even hold a candle to Rose.
    Sorry Mike, you will always be the best, I grew up watching you play, stayed awake up to 300am just to watch you, had your posters on my wall etc. etc., but man…you suck at this, don’t cry because of it, do something about it – like you always did, let your “game” speak. ;)

  21. people are hypocrites says:

    if your job gave you the option to negotiate then you’d all be arguing over the 35 thousand you make. i know i would. stop getting on the players, the players said they would be glad to take pay cuts if the money from their pay cuts were going back into the sport and not the owners pocket. the owners aren’t saying we’re taking their pay cuts and going to lower ticket prices or less ad time on tv or better working conditions for the people in the stadium maybe lower the prices on souvenirs. stop complaining about their wages kobe bryant would be making over 20 mil this season. and you better believe that the lakers are making at least, at least 400% profit off of him. and you guys think he makes too much? he makes what’s in his industry. you want to pay him 5 million and he brings in 150 million+ to the lakers. i mean com’on guys, yeah there are some over paid donkeys in the NBA but lets get rea,l 4 billion dollars is a lot of money, that’s a pretty big pot and the players are THE direct result of that pot. i pay to watch the players, so it’s only right that they get their fair share, not equal share but at least a fair share.

  22. Rahul says:

    However i forgot to say one more thing .JORDON how could you ,you were the basketball icon. Notice i used the word were . You should have ensured it would not get to this stage . i cannot take away from what you have done for the game when you played it. Certainly now in my mind , the love for the game no longer comes first to you . i hope i am wrong but i somehow i feel that i am right . Money is your biggest issue ,isnt that right NBA owners .Well for one you arent getting mine anymore .So once more BYE BYE NBA bye bye now.

  23. Tommy says:

    I agree with Alexe that the players are greedy, however I doudt that it is the players themselves but their representatives.

    Their situation is unbelievable! The players are making an exorbitant amount of money in a recession where many people are struggling to keep a roof over their head, and they want more. They should be ashamed! The details of their deal with the NBA is quite complex, and they should be happy with whatever extra money they get on top of their huge salaries.
    Also Kobe, Lebron, Kevin Durante, and others have lifetime stats that will be lowered without a season , and what about rookies who will make zero dollars as opposed to many millions this year. Is this supposed to help them. The attorneys and other non players profit from these delays

  24. WHOOSH28 says:

    This is business. I think many folks do not understand that. The NBA players and owners are a partnership and that partnership forms the NBA. Owners are not bosses and players are not employees. They are a partnership. Both undrs contractual agreement to provide the necessary committment to the NBA and its entertainment to its fans. The owners are not happy with the partnership and want more money; yet; they have been unable to justify why they need more money and exactly what they have lost. Even though the economy is struggling; tickets are still being sold; items bought, and tv deals made. Least it was til the lockout. The owners feel they are the cog in the wheel and feel they can control this process and get what they want; fair or not. They believe the players will cave because they cannot withstand a lost season; whereas the Owners can afford several lost seasons. So the owners are basically bullying the players into a bad deal. So hence the lockout.

    I hear tons of folks saying the NBA players are rich crybabies. But exactly what do you think the owners are?

    I keep hearing 50/50 is fair. And I’d agree it was fair if it meant that both sides were getting the same money. But it doesn’t. Owners are getting 50%; there are 30 owners. Players are getting 50%; there are 450 players; active players: that doesn’t account for the players who are retired and receiving pensions. When you take that detail into account; you realize the players are making a few million a year while the owners are making a few hundred million a year. Tell me why an owner isn’t happy with a few hundred million? I’d like to hear that one.

    So the current 57% and 43%….an offer was made by players to give up 4%….go 53%, 47%. This is what I call a compromise. Yet, owners claim unless they get 50/50 or 40/50 or 53/47; they will refuse to negoitiate. So tell me; who is the crybabies? Another offer was made at 50/50 with a revenue sharing option that goes toward pensions (1%)…. They were willing to give up 6%. Yet in return; they didn’t want a hard cap; although agreed to higher luxury taxes and contract re-negoitations.

    If anything, I see the players being reasonable. Standing strong but at the same time, compromising for the good of the game. I see the owners locking out a season until they get what they want.

    Pathetic is the owners.

    I will not boycott the players. But if I could, I’d boycott the owners. I’d love to see a revenue sharing system where the fans can vote for who they support: players or owners. Then I would certainly root for the players in every fashion of the NBA. They are the reason I watch. And from where I stand, the only thing preventing me from watching them today are the owners and their greed.

    So the players have only one choice. Stand and fight. As an individual, I’d do the same thing. So I will back them every step of the way.

    • Hello says:

      “Tell me why an owner isn’t happy with a few hundred million? I’d like to hear that one.”

      They’re not taking home a few hundred million. They have invested money and have future expenses that the “few hundred million” (inflated figure) goes against. And if you believe the owners, the expenses outweigh the 50% of income for a lot of them. The 50% the players make is take home (after taxes) with no risk. That’s a key detail you fail to take into account. Duh…

  25. Bryce says:

    In my Opinion I think it is the NBA and the coaches fault for allowing the players to get so much money! I don’t blame the players for not agreeing to the 50-50 deal because they are so used to having so much money! that they would not know what to do with their money even if the little percentage of money has been taken. The thing that is frustrating is why play overseas when they NBA players would make less money! If the dumb managers would if saw what was coming when they would raise the paycheck for the NBA players every year starting when the last lock out ended this Lock out today would never happen! and you have to remeber in paychecks the manger always has control over an individuals paycheck in business or any occupation! I respect the managers but not when they give too much money to the players because too much money leads to greed! And when the nba players get greedy. They only play ball just for the sake of money! In my opinion if you truly love basketball why not only play just to have fun for the sake of basketball! and not for the money! Well we all need money to survive but an addiction of money is ridiculous!

  26. Rahul says:

    You know what, im an ardent basketball fan in india, the games get televised at 4 am here and i still get up to watch em . Its such a shame that these guys ,billionares and multi millionares coudnt reach a deal in time .What were they doing the last few years ,counting their money i guess . i completely agree with DALTON , let them finally agree to a deal, whenever that is or let the courts decide , i dont really care . i am not going to be following up on the NBA anymore , i hope the fan bases drop drastically the next few years . To be honest i dont care which side is in the right anymore ,though it would seem that the owners were just pushing their luck till the breaking point without giving fair concessions . But like i said i dont care, so bye bye NBA basketball ,im going to find a new source of sports entertainment. I hope all the fans realise that while the owners and players are fighting for their supposed rights ,they completely and i mean totally forgot about their fans and left their hanging , so screw them .So i hope a good deal is eventually reached because like fellow angry fan DALTOn said” Zero per cent of nothing is nothing, right? lets see their real revenue source ‘the fan”, dry up and tell me how far each side get in their negotiations” . GO GO LETS BOYCOTT THE NBA YO .

  27. Sarah says:

    The way I see it, this is all about greed. 22 otu of the 30 teams in the league don’t make a profit, and they haven’t for several years. I don’t think any side desrves more than the other, and 50/50 would’ve been a fair deal. If it’s a matter of pride, I really don’t see whyt he players had to reject 50.2% when the players offered it. Not to mention that the NBA is going to lose the majority of it’s fans, just like when the first lockout happened. Aren’t they just screwing themselves over in a way?
    I don’t know the whole story, and I doubt anyone commenting knows every little detail about this lockout. All I know is that I miss watching basketball, for some reason college just isn’t the same.
    Hopefully this catastrophy will end soon, I need my NBA back!

  28. Dalton says:

    Stacy, I would like to stand behind Mike and the guys that believe that fans should boycott the NBA. Zero per cent of nothing is nothing, right? lets see their real revenue source ‘the fan”, dry up and tell me how far each side get in their negotiations. For a world that is on the brink of economic calamity, and for millionaire athletes and billionaire owners to treat their ‘meal tickets’ as if we are door mats, leaves me fuming. It is comendable that the players are not capitulating to the owners draconian tactics, but know this…. the rank and file players who are greatful to earn a pay check for doing something they would normally do as a recreation and knowing they are at the bottom of the food chain and knowing that the ratification of a deal really means more to their superstar counterparts than they themselves, they would gladly have taken the NBA’s last offer AND RUN…as they do not stand to make that kind of money EVER. Dont get me wrong, I am not for the owners ‘Plantation Owner’ mannerisms either, and let me say some, as not all the owners are in the same boat. It is unconscienable, that both sides would deprive their fans of their favorite past time activity of watching some basketball….. I for one is already feeling depressed about not having basketball to turn to after a long and harduous day at work. This is just plain Madness. As a side note, I cant wait for that show with Shaq, Charles and the gang to hit the air.

    Peace
    Angry Fan

  29. Brain32 says:

    If I was loosing money on the buissness I would sell/terminate it not talk fairy tales and making up stupid proposals…
    So I say players all the way.

  30. Just asking says:

    @gary are one of them??? dude are you getting 50/50 deal with them??? why are protecting those greedy bastards!!!

  31. Aaron says:

    No one buys Mark Cuban running shoes or Micky Arison sport jackets. People buy tickets and jerseys and other merchandise to support players. So think if someone bought something with your name or likeness on it shouldnt you get a cut of that? That is what BRI is. That is why players should get more than 50-50 of BRI.

    That said BRI is not that sticking point in this dispute. What is happening here is the owners dont want the NBA to end up like MLB. The same teams going to the playoffs and the same teams winning championships. The people who are to blame for this labor dispute are Lebron, Bosh, Amare, Carmello. These players held their teams captive while deciding where to play. Players should have the freedom to not only where to play, but also where their family should live, however teams should also be able to keep their players to grow their team. Its that balance of player retention and player freedom that the 2 sides cannot agree on.

    As a fan I will not boycott. I love watching the game and watching the best players play. I also hope the leage gets its way in terms of competitive balance. Think how amazing the NBA would be if we had a Green Bay equivalent. NY and LA will make money no matter what. The leage needs to make a deal that will allow Indianna, Sacramento, and other small market teams to not only make money but also be competative.

  32. AY says:

    All this is not good. Both parties need not to be selfish for a few bucks more. Let’s think about the domino effect this lockout has and will have on others. The restaurants, transportation, hotels, the little people sellind different stuff, THE FANS, I can go on and on. Come on guys let’s be real. Let’s get this season on the way. Be careful if you wait too long, you won’t have anyone watching you play. Let’s bring back the fun!!!!!! Fisher I am a Laker fan, do the right thing.

  33. AZ says:

    This nonsense has to stop. We need basketball!! 99 all over again (although at that point in time the economy wasn’t screwed like it is now), and this time it doesn’t realistically look like there’s gonna be an NBA season. The closer we get to christmas without a deal, the less optimistic I get…no preseason training/games/rookie program etc you can’t do all that properly in half a season, it’s impossible. It’s pretty sad but my life feels kinda empty without NBA basketball :P

  34. alexe says:

    The players are greedy. Period.

  35. Dimebag Darrell says:

    CAN’T WAIIT 4 THE SEASON TO START….JUST GET THE DEAL DONE PEOPLE….

  36. Viper139 says:

    Once the 50:50 split was on the table, the owners should have moved on the system issues. Those system issues the owners are asking for are really hard to swallow if just just gave up almost a billion dollars of earnings on the players side.

    I do understand both sides, but the way both sides are handling it now it will only harm a great business. Even so some money was lost during the last couple of years – what business in the world did not loose money, concerning the business enviroment.

    OWNERS – Take a step back on the system issures and get this done. The players have moved enough.

    We as fans just want basketball or we will abondone this sport alltogether. Not that there is no other sport out there we could identify with ;)

  37. Bojeezy says:

    This is getting sad because there isn’t as much news about the lockout anymore. No more new meetings, just news about players fleeing to play in other countries. I think the NBAPA made a mistake thinking that the NBA were willing to negotiate with them. They just got duped, hoodwinked, bamboozled. They should of filed the Disclaimer of Interest when Paul Allen showed up to the negotiating process and went back on the negotiating they had done the previous days. I could clearly see that they weren’t going to budge on a lot of the issues. Even though I was wishing they would of. I don’t know why it took so long to go this route? What was Billy Hunter and Derek Fisher smoking? The writing was already on the wall. The on and off negotiations. Now, I am thinking it is too late to do anything because the NBA is not going to give the players what they want. A fair deal should not even be considered to be a outcome. The players should of taken that last best offer of 50/50 and system restrictions the NBA gave them and play the season out. Then after the season is done go on STRIKE which I think they could of still done since the Player’s Union was still in tack. I am a lot like the many disappointed basketball fans out there. Hoping against hope for an NBA season but that is seemingly less likey. It is gonna take a miracle. I am praying that one will happen for the NBA this Christmas.

  38. pandoy says:

    I wonder,,,,is it really money or about power? The owners should be more responsible when picking their GMs. They’re the ones who negotiate contracts, good or bad. Still, you can’t blame them for wanting more control. I don’t think any owner or GM would want to re-live something like ‘The Decision’, the NBA, particularly the owners, would like to avoid being taken hostage, thus driving them to hold the players by their necks and offer a deal that in the eyes of many only benefits them.
    I observed the 98-99 lockout, back then it was really about the profit, now it it just seems to me it’s more about power, the power to control your employees.
    I may be wrong….but, just a thought.

  39. marc says:

    definitely dissapointed in the NBA and the players. I don’t think though that the NBA started this without a good reason, so there must be organisations that don’t make enough money. I also think that the contracts with players have gotten out of control over the last years.. they should stop overpaying athlets..
    anyway, even if the season starts at some point I won’t be buying any NBA stuff for a while..

  40. watcher says:

    Great post Dan. Nailed it perfectly. Kudos

  41. hegalian2012 says:

    This so-called lockout is not ALL about MONEY! It’s MOSTLY about CONTROL!

  42. Dan says:

    It wasn’t debate over the financial split that caused the negotiations to break down. The two sides had agreed on a 50-50 spit. The negotiations broke down over “system issues” in relation to teams that choose to have a payroll above the salary cap. The owners had already agreed to continue a soft salary cap with a luxury tax rather than a hard cap even though both the NFL and NHL have hard caps. The owners agreed to allow guaranteed contracts — something that NFL players do not have even though NFL players are FAR more susceptible to major injuries. However, the owners proposed a more punative luxury tax than the prior tax to further discourage teams from going over the cap. Although I think the owners gave enough on the system issues, recognizing that the other two winter sports have a fixed hard salary cap, I do wish the owners had made a few more concessions on system issues to get a deal done. On the other hand, none of us knows how much additional ground the owners needed to give to get a deal done. At some point the owners can’t give any more on system issues wiithout ending up with same sort of imbalance that exists today. If only a few teams in the most lucrative and attractive markets have a legitimate shot at a championship, then attendance and sponsorship will ultimately decline in the majority of markets. At some point the League would need to contract. That would mean fewer jobs for players and less revenue overall. The players are being incredibly naive and short-sighted in this. They look awfully pathetic being led around like cattle by a few high-powered agents who want to maximize the money they make off the few elite stars in the NBA.

    This notion that the players gave enough by agreeing to 50% in contrast to the 57% under the old deal is silly. The 57% spit was a gravy train for the players, but a terrible deal for the League. That split resulted in the owners losing money collectively with only a small minority of teams making money. The 57% was agreed to at the height of the dot com bubble. It was as unreaslitic and economically unsound as the millions of bad mortgages around the country. So the 57% split should have absolutely no relevance to the current bargaining situation. The better benchmark for determining a reasonable revenue split is the split in other leagues. The 50% split that the NBA players and owners agreed to last week is in line with the splits in other sports. NFL players, for example, get 48%.

    The two sides should get back to the bargaining table and the owners should give the players another one or two small face-saving concessions on the system issues. But that’s not going to happen. By choosing to decertify and file lawsuits, the players have embarked on a perilous course that will harm the League and leave the players ultimately with a worse deal than the deal they turned down. That’s what happened to the NHL players when the NHL season was cancelled a number of years ago. The NBA players union has horrible leadership and representation. The agents took control and it will cost the players dearly.

    • Viper139 says:

      you are right – just a couple of teams did win the championship over the last couple of years – but look at the last 8 teams in this years playoffs – Both Oklahoma, Memphis are small market teams which had a shot at winning it all – just by good management and not overly stuffed rosters.
      If Michael Jordan as a owner would be just as good at picking players as he was at going to the basket, we would not be here. He seems to be one of the hardliners on the owners side on this. I really love what he did for basketball, but right now he should have been smart enough to understand not to push to hard.

      Sure this is about agents earnings just as it is about players and owners earnings, but what all of them are doing now ist just plain killing the earnings they want to distribute.

      Silly – all of you !!!!!! If you would have agreed to that deal two month ago you ALL would be better off in 10 years, as you ever will be now as this takes the course it is. Everybody is loosing – what a shame.

    • killin it says:

      EXACTLY!!!!

      look to all that say players have given up this much and that much, they haven’t conceded anything, as THIS IS A NEW CBA. I honestly think the D league clause, that Gary preaches about is a good thing, it will ensure players perform, and are held accountable for their stupidity (see players like arenas, michael beasley and his drugs etc). The only party that seems to lose in this are the players, but hey that’s business. Owners foot the bill, and in this economic climate, it’s unlikely there’s a line of owners waiting to buy teams, especially after this.

      Players heading off to europe to play ball is a bad move on their part, as now they have lost their leg to stand on in court. I also don’t think anyone here understands the hierarchy of sport in europe, unless they’re european. Owners of teams in europe are far more concerned about their football teams then the paltry basketball department chucked together as an afterthought. So now players have lost their perks and pay when they play in Europe. They’ll hate the system because they’ll be punished for their prima donna attitudes with plenty of time riding pine.

      As I’ve said players are replaceable, it’s not rocketscience, name 20 superstars from the 90′s that haven’t been replaced. I Doubt many of you can, and those who do so, are nostalgic..

      • Gary says:

        Your telling me that you could right now replace the Kobe, Dwight, Rose, Lebron, Dirk, Wade, Carmello, Nash, Amarie, Manu, Garrnet, Pierce, Allen, Durant, Westbrook, D Williams, CP3, Duncan, Parker, Gasol? Okay if that was even close to true don’t you think owners would have been doing that rather than raising the salaries of these guys to keep them? Yes they are overpaid, but you can’t see basketball as exciting as this anywhere else. And if you can go watch it, and don’t worry about these guys.

    • defdun says:

      Good summary Dan.
      However the owners should have been more transparent and opened up their books to show that they are losing money. We all know how easily figures can be manipulated (financial engineering). And also in negotiations you don’t come with an offer and say this is it, take it or we go back to a mucher offer. Ridiculous and arrogant way or bargaining. As you say 50:50 seemed fair and system issues should have been cleared in 1 or 2 more bargaining sessions. Now both sides have lost and we are locked, as noone wants to lose face. How pathetic!

      Best way out is to get Clinton (thanks DA!) or someone to arbitrate this mess into a deal.

  43. TS says:

    When the NBA gets going again, I see an apology to the fans in order. For causing a global panic to worldwide basketball and cities across the country, I think free admission to the first 3 games of the season would be a great place to start.

  44. jus10 says:

    It will hit the press soon, but a lot of the people organizing the “Occupys” have been following this ridiculous greed by the NBA and Players. Their is soon to be an official movement to boycott NBA Games if and when they ever start again.

  45. Torosnegros says:

    I’m so going to get crapped on for this. At first I was looking at everyone involved as being a bunch of rich crybabies. But then a friend said something to me. The players are doing this out of pride, not necessarily for money, of which they’re losing more than gaining by being stubborn. I’m not a fan of the idea of players going where they want, when they want either. But…. I can’t boycott, because I respect that the players are standing for what they think is RIGHT. I wish more people did. So, even though my greed makes me want to see basketball on tv, I’m going to forego that and support the player’s right to stand for an ideal. Sigh… let the hating commence :(

    • Eric Zap says:

      No, a few players are speaking for all of them. They’ve had no vote that tells what all of the players want. I’d bet they’d be back to work if they did.

  46. Jay says:

    I’m Very Sadden That The NBA Has Come To A Lockout… Boycott My Fellow Fans

  47. BEST PLAYER IN NBA DERICK FISHER says:

    Ok, since there are morons out there who think the PLAYERS can play or PROMOTE themselves without the BANKROLL, LETS SEE IT HAPPEN. Most players cant spell their own name, let alone start a new league, LOL. Who are you kidding (obviously just yourself). Everyone who thinks the players should get 57%, obviously you dont own or will ever own your own BUSINESS!!!!! That is not how the real world works. The owners were billionaires before they bought their teams, and they will be billionaires if their teams go out of business. Where will that leave the players, who think they know more than everyone else. Alot of people are struggling, and the players dont think 50% and the new changes in the league will be sufficient enough for them to play? Really? Really? If the OWNERS win the BATTLE in court, (just like the NFL won), the OWNERS are going to teach the players a real lesson about LIFE!! All contracts will be voided and if you dont like it, you will be replaced!!!!!!!!!!!! The owners had to abide by the system for years, when they did nothing but lose money. NO MORE, they are changing the leauge similar to the NFL system. If you dont perform, your contract will dictate that. No more fake injuries, no more not getting back on defense or offense. There is about to be some major changes in the NBA, and that IS WHAT THE PLAYERS ARE AFRAID OF. They are concerned, that their FREE MEAL TICKET FOR NOT PRODUCING, HAS COME TO AN END!!!!!! At the end of every contract, OWNERS for the sake of the league and their teams had to take it in the rear. so the players and AGENTS, didnt hold the LEAGUE and TEAMS hostage, WHICH PLAYERS HAVE BEEN GETTING AWAY WITH FOR A LONG TIME!!!!!! Now the OWNERS are going to take their TEAMS and the LEAGUE BACK!!!!!!!! And that is WHAT THE PLAYERS ARE AFRAID OF!!!!!! NO MORE FREE RIDES!! PRODUCE OR GET CUT!!!!!!!! NFL RULES!!!!!!!

    • Dennis says:

      Completely agree, look at Rashard Lewis.. gets a mad deal and starts doing nothing and Owners have no power to sack the prick.. Hinrich same.

      • people are hypocrites says:

        Dennis if you were the Magic’s GM would YOU ever have signed rashard lewis to an 15 million dollar+ contract?…so is that rashard lewis’s fault or the GM’s fault? (in other words is this the players fault or the owners fault?) rashard lewis NEVER even gave any signs to potentially being a 15 million dollar player.

    • Eric Zap says:

      Thank you.

      And Gary, if that really is your name and not Kevin Garnett or something. . . I give you kudos for defending your point so aggressively.

  48. Steve says:

    It makes me sick to hear players say “I just love the game, I might have to go overseas and play”. No, those players with the loudest voices in this dispute love the money, because that is the issue here, a desire for an excess of money. Sure, the owners lust after it too, covetousness knows no bounds. The whole culture of the USA is the problem here. The NBA is just this year’s example. Will it be the NHL next year, or baseball again? I have no interest in watching American avarice masquerading as sport. Greed is your problem, and quibbling over who gets the largest share of the average person’s dollar is stomach turning. Both sides want a “fair deal”, while the people who pay to watch the game get a raw deal. You can keep your “land of the fee”, I’ll never visit your country again.

  49. Al says:

    Cracks me up that the players will go and play overseas, for probably half maybe less of what they are currently paid. Plus bus rides instead of planes etc. Whats up with that ?

    If the league is losing money, well the longer they hold out the more they save. It seems the other way for the players. The league has lots of money invested. Its a business, if the players of been riding high on the hog for the last 3 years during the recession Why should the owners keep losing money to keep the hog alive ?

  50. Jonathan says:

    with 22 teams losing last season, something drastic must be done. the NBA indeed must overhaul its policies. It will not be good to see just 10 teams playing in the NBA with 30 games a season. Or to see California, New York, and Texas with 3 or 4 teams just playing among themselves. for the good league, the NBA must be willing to sacrifice a season or two to overhaul its policies. Then a better and healthy NBA will be reborn.

  51. Lochie says:

    The players need to understand they already make a ridiculous amount of money and taking a little less wont hurt them in the least. Its just selfish and is really frustrating. If you really loved playing the game so much then you wouldnt care about the money!

  52. S.CelticFan says:

    Pierce is a great player, I just think that we’ve all had enough crap. Politics aside, it’s time for everyone to get lost in a game. Personally football bores me as does hockey. Basketball is the ONLY major sport that’s truly American as it was invented in Springfield Ma. That being the case I wish these people would just shut up and get back to the hardwood where they belong.

  53. tiger says:

    All of you are saying you’re going to boycott the NBA when the lockout ends, but I guarantee you all will be watching the NBA on TV.

  54. SP says:

    Maybe Vince MacMahon could start a rebel basketball league called the XBL and it could be 0.0000001% more satisfying than having no season at all?

  55. David says:

    Change the NBA commissioner as well as the owners! There are lots of rich people out there who are willing to own an NBA team. The League cannot just instantly replace the current NBA players with college players, etc. Who will watch them anyway on that broader stage! BRING BACK THE NBA!

  56. TZipp says:

    One of the fundamental rules of negotiation is start high and meet lower. Not start at 50/50, then go 47.5%… Then back to 50/50 with an ultimatum. Sterns sloppy negotiating tactics are insulting. If Stern wants a partnership, shoulda lost the take it of leave it boss mentality. That said, players should have taken that last deal. It IS all about pride.. Screw the league and the players.

    • Gary says:

      Players at one point where ready to take 51 percent I believe. Then the owners go throwing out new clauses like the D-league one, and players weren’t having it. Owners brought this on themselves.

  57. jj says:

    the interesting thing about PIerce’s decertification standpoint is that he doesn’t necessarily want to decertify in order to fight against the owners, but instead he wants to decertify to take the negotiation process out of Hunter and Fisher’s hands, thinking that those 2 guys are just unskilled to lead this situation to a good outcome. And if this is the case, I like his position.

  58. bballer says:

    Just cancel the whole season and stop going to the media and cry about who’s fault is it.

  59. Mike Gold says:

    As a business owner, how much profit would you like to see on your investment. I hear what the players are saying, but I also understand the owners. When someone elects to hire you, pay you and invest their money in their decision, they want to make sure they have a good return. The players are employees. Either you accept the pay or move on, you don’t try to sue someone who doesn’t want to pay you what you feel you are worth. Before any of these guys turned pro, they were eager to just make it into the NBA, now they want to tell owners what they should be paid. Fair is fair, but you don’t set the rate of pay.

  60. Joanne Rowe says:

    If Kobe got a team together why couldn’t they lease the staple center ,those arenas are there to make money if the players wanted to get an international contract to air tv games with these stars that we have now ,who is going to stop them ,money talks .All these Players have to do is start now while they are still popular if they sit out for two years it will be too late they need to rename each team and start their own teams if they have to sit out this season and their still is a lockout. ,Mayweather promotes himself ,they probally said that it couldn’t be done. The players let the owners take 700 million off the top and than they were spliting the balance 57 to 43 so 30 people divided 43% and 450 people divided 57% and every dime was generated by the players this is the greatest rip off of all time.

  61. Anthony says:

    In my opinion the NBA Players are being extremely selfish throughout this whol process. The already make millions of dollars every single year so why are they being greedy and asking for more? They dont deserve to have more.. I remember when NBA Players played for the love of the game.. Now its all about MONEY! NBA Players also want a soft sallary cap which will ruin the entire league. It will be like baseball. All the big name players will be on the same team in big cityies, because those teams can afford it being in bigger markets. And that could ultimately be the down fall. The Teams that are in the smaller markets wont be able to bring in enough fans, because there team couldnt afford to bring in super stars. Which is why when this lockout is over and the cry-baby players get there way, Dwight Howard will be in Los Angeles, and a few other big name players shall be traded and what not to other big cities; which will force the smaller teams to fend for themselves against the powerhouse teams. I am on board with what the NBA is doing and I hope for all of the fans sake they don’t back down.

    **Drops the mic and walks away**

    • Gary says:

      I stopped reading your comment when you said the players are asking for more. You clearly have no understanding of what is going on.

  62. Steve says:

    What does a “Full Season” lockout mean for the 2012 Summer Olympics? Who is on the team?? Who will coach?? How does that pan out for the players looking to play overseas??

  63. SAD says:

    NBA you have just lost a fan

  64. G says:

    Very nice, 40 greedy guys decided that it would be the best option for 450 persons!!! Pierce and kg should Just go oversea and play for some loose change!!! Both of you probably has 2 more years to go any way.

  65. Alon says:

    Please just let them play!!!!!!! both sides need to grow up! Don’t let us go by without a whole year of no NBA… I would go crazy! Owenrs want players to play, fans want players to play, and players want to play! SO JUST PLAY!!

  66. Pekka Laaksonen says:

    If the 50 / 50 split is ok with the players, I really dont get the big mess about system issues. If they require handsome checks for top players through free agency etc, to my understanding that would mean lesser check for the bench players, if the 50% is still the maximum.
    Seems like the agents, the union and everybody on that side is only interested in the big names pay checks, so we are not seeing games because the big names and their agents dont agree. If the total payable to the players is something like 2 billion to me it does not make any sense to miss the season on issues on how to divide the 2 billion on players. Especially, when it seems like all the system issues are to improve the checks for the big names.
    If those free agency issues, midlevel issues and other issues etc are means to make the split something other than 50-50, then I understand.
    But I thought the 50-50 was basically agreed.
    So where is the beef?

  67. gpxi says:

    I am convinced now that Paul Pierce is a hot-headed idiot.

  68. Matt W says:

    Here are the simple facts: If the NBA collapses the owners will lose a lot of money but they’re worth a whole lot more and the world will keep spinning. The players on the other hand will have two choices: permanently move their families and lives overseas to get decent money playing against each other, or sign with a new upstart league that doesn’t have anywhere near the resources of the NBA. Smaller arenas, less money, less distribution etc. The players are employees of organisations, and employees do not and should not have as much power as the employers. Michael Jordan has been retired for over a decade, Kobe Bryant will probably be gone in the next 5 years, but the Chicago Bulls and LA Lakers will go on existing and people will still watch basketball. It’s the franchises that matter, and sure, you can make the argument people are paying to watch the players, but the NBA facilitates them. If they’re going to continue with this attitude of being bigger than the company they work for then to hell with them. Fire them all and sign any free agents, scabs and college players are willing to play for money. Sure it’ll suck for a while, but I’d rather have some basketball to watch. Oh wait, NCAA.

  69. stacy James says:

    Dan Lindsey, thank you for helping me educate some the people making comments on this threat. I really appreciate someone pointing out the financial facts of standard Corporate revenue-personnel-expenditures. Players started at 57%, went to 53%, and even then went down to 51%. Owners want their cake and eat it too. Players are perfectly entitled to 80%. If owners can’t make a business run on 43% of revenue, there’s a problem with their business model. That means they are paying themselves too much, and I for one never believe the revenue figures cooked up by the super rich owners, or their side speaking, threat spewing, sabre rattling League Representatives.

  70. End Lockout says:

    GET A DEAL DONE STOP BEING GREEDY OWNERS REAL NBA FANS MISS THE TNT DOUBLE HEADERS, AND HEARING MARV ALBERT, “OH A SPECTACULAR MOVE”

  71. stacy James says:

    The Flying Scotsman – In 1615, George Ruggle wrote a play called Ignoramus, about a lawyer who knew nothing about the law; this fictional lawyer soon gave his name to all manner of know-nothings (like yourself), whether lawyers or non-lawyers. The modern nonlegal meaning appears most frequently in Basketball fans who are not for the Players.

    And I LOVE IT that you called me Castro. It’s appropriate actually. At least Castro had courage to stand up to the Corporate American juggernaut. Or maybe you’re just one of those people who still believe everything you heard from someone else without checking it out for yourself. Lol! All I can say to you is that you’ve just lost your right to vote!!! Lol! Why don’t you go join Mike, Eric Zap, r Shanks and Cameron. Maybe you can all form your own country where anyone, even Ignoramuses have a valued opinion. If you’re not behind the players in this deal you’re with the owners who want to make sure you make less money and do exactly as they say, even if you are making them 34 billion dollars a decade plus inflation. NBA owners are the Real Dictators.

  72. Dan Lindsay says:

    53% of BRI or even more is not an unreasonable percentage for the players. In any business, employee wages and benefits is the largest percentage cost to the owner. In many businesses, employee costs exceed 80% of total income.

    And don’t forget that BRI is not total income; the owners have a lot of other cash coming in that the players don’t get to look at, such as parking fees. For some reason, that’s not considered BRI.

    Perhaps a bigger issue for the players than total income is the guaranteed contracts. I’ve never heard of any business except the NFL where the owner gets to void a contract any time he wants to, with no recourse by the employee who’s fired. If I sign a one- or three-year contract with my boss, as long as I do what I promised to do when I signed the contract, he can’t fire me. Nor can I quit and go elsewhere. That’s what a contract is. But the NBA owners want to be able to hold the players to their part of the bargain, but toss them out like the trash any time they want to. That’s not right, and the players are absolutely correct in rejecting it.

    And I do not believe for a moment that most NBA teams are losing money. If it’s true, the owners should be willing to open their books and prove it. Instead they say, “Trust us, we’re losing money — but we won’t let you see the evidence.”

  73. paul forster says:

    Hi im an NBA fan from the uk,im gutted with the lock out.The NBA and the players must see that the only people missing out are the fans,the games over the christmas season are what i look forward to the most and it dosnt look like its going to happen this year what a loss.Im all for the players fighting for a fair deal but they must make a fortune already.Maby they should just respect the fans more play the games and leave the court stuff behined closed doors,after all if they loose the fans who will they and the NBA be then.

  74. Stacy James you sound like a dictator like Castro.

    There needs to be intelligence and “informative tests” put in place to allow people to say anything, or vote for anything. Over and out! Maybe I’ll see you in Europe Paul. Love ya man!

    No one can buy or sell a house. No one can have more than one child. No one can have plastic bags. No one can have a waist size over 33 inches.

    http://www.havanatimes.org/?p=54833
    For the first time in decades, citizens and permanent foreign residents can now buy and sell houses or apartments and they will be permitted to have an additional vacation home.

    Here’s a quote from the Woody Allen movie Bannanas:

    Esposito: From this day on, the official language of San Marcos will be Swedish. Silence! In addition to that, all citizens will be required to change their underwear every half-hour. Underwear will be worn on the outside so we can check. Furthermore, all children under 16 years old are now… 16 years old!
    Fielding Mellish: What’s the Spanish word for straitjacket?

  75. stacy James says:

    Cameron, this is what I’m talking about. You’re trying to compare customer service to the NBA? Ummm, in your infinite wisdom you’ve forgotten one thing. Most Customer Service people don’t make their CEO’s 34 BILLION over ten years. I’d compare NBA players to Vice Presidents of Sales & Marketing + On Court Operations Managers. Lol! If I was doing all those jobs and making my CEO”s that much cash, damn right I’d be demanding a piece of the pie. Cameron why don’t you listen to “JustThinking”.
    Oh and maybe you want to learn to write proper English “Tslk sbout iron8c”. That’s exactly what I’m talking about, people without an understanding of the situation might as well not make a comment.

  76. will says:

    boycott does sound like a good idea and if the media gets this maybe it will spark the players and owners to make a deal.

  77. You make your billions and THEN you buy an NBA team. These owners didn’t make their wealth by starting an NBA team. Yes some are profitable but it’s a billionaires toy. You can’t compare this with a regular business like a restaurant or a store. The Players and most people obviously don’t understand the difference. The players ignorance and stupidity are the ones losing. The owners should reset the league. Tell all the players to go back to work or they are banned from the NBA for life. How many players do you think will began to understand the reality of the situation. The owners are greedy but that’s how they made their money so they could splurge on an NBA toy. The players on the other hand are dispensable. Stars today are forgotten quickly – hot dog AI, Tracy McGraddy, Brandon Roy,. The owners can manufacutred new stars quickly – Blake Griffin perfect example – marquee player in 1 year. Legally the owners can void all NBA contracts and start again. In two years we will be saying Paul Peirce who?? Garnnet who? yes even Kobe who? These NBA players are as dumb as the the occupy mob (well may be not that dumb – those mao/stalin fan’s ignorance is absolutely staggering

    • Gary says:

      Ha! You think the owners can just produce superstars at will?! Players are not as dispensable as you think. I would actually love to see the owners try to replace the players, only to see how much of a failure the league would be. The NBA as of right now has the best of the best IMO. You think there’s just some Joe schmo sitting on his couch waiting to be the next Kobe Bryant?!

  78. Rand says:

    I listened to an interview with super agent David Falk and was blown away by his experience and knowledge about this process. The players and the NBA should sit down with him and have HIM mediate the deal. That is what he does for a living! He negotiates between players and the NBA!

  79. brixey says:

    hi guys

    i’m a HUGE nba fan from the uk. the thing i don’t get is when the players rejected this latest deal how are they ever gonna get a better one from the owners?? how does going through the courts get them a better deal than what they were last offered??

  80. GT says:

    The truth is players love the game and will always play, even if there was no money in it players will still play, pick up games, on the streets, over seas. The league need the players, true the players won’t get paid as much anywhere else in the world but we all know they will get looked after, even if they only get paid 5x that of a doctors salary, in stead of 1000x.

  81. Joe Kokro says:

    This is very sad especially for the young guys who were about to get out of the Slums to better life. I want to appeal to the veterans who probably have enough money to live on for the rest of their lives to be considerate not only for the present crops of young players but to future generations who will depend on the game to get out of the housing projects.
    Please, I’m not suggesting that when people are poor, it’s ground to accept exploitation of any kind. What I’m against is selfish greed that tends to blind one from considering others. Pleasey Guys do the best you can and keep the game going.

    To the Owners I say, do not attempt to exploit the situation because majority of your employees come from the lower bottom of the economic ladder. They may have come from poor back grouds, but god gave them the Talents to over come their situations. Let good and moral heads prevail.

  82. JustThinking says:

    I’m just thinking out loud here,,,
    The owners pay employees. The employees ask for a raise (never a reduction in pay). The owners say “ok”, or “no way”. The individual employee says “ok, I’ll get a new job”. Sound about right? Then you have profits and losses. Owners charge a price for tickets and they make a profit off those sales. People are willing to pay more so the owners up the price of tickets. Now, in some markets, owners can’t charge as much so their ticket price is lower. Thus their profits are lower, and thus they can’t pay employees as much in salary. So the best employees move to where the higher salaries are paid. Given this scenario, the NBA owners decided to work together, and pool their businesses so that these smaller market owners could still pay the higher salaries and keep their best employees in town. So the years go by and the competition is good and the parity is getting there. But some small market owners aren’t successful and are losing money. So the owners get together to see what they can do to help. And they agree that they will all limit the amount each employee can make so that the employee costs will be lower for all owners. And, well, gee, the employees said “No thanks!”.
    Is that about right?

  83. Angelo says:

    I don’t really follow the NBA as much as I used to and don’t understand the issues behind the lockout and the technicalities surrounding it but correct me if I’m wrong when thinking that both players, owner and the league are all discussing how much more or less of millionaire they’ll all be or wish to be ?

    This in a time when the entire world is on financial problems with huge unemployment everywhere and poverty and starvation in less developed countries ?!?!?!

    I say (and I remind you I don’t know much about the technicalities here) that all those players/owners involved settle for a 48% each way with the remaining 4% going to charities and/or helping the unemployed, hungry, etc all over the US or even worldwide health/charitable organisations.

    Just a thought…….

    Angelo (Europe)

  84. alvaro says:

    look at this from all points of view… if you have a bussiness lets say.. selling shoes, and you pay a guy to sell the shoes, Why Should You Give HIm Half Of The Money You Earn By Selling Shoes???

    Players Get Paid Millions In Salary, The Team Pay The Plains And Hotels When They’re On The Road, Give Them Medical threatmen if they are injuried, they use the training facilities of the team.. so i think the players are the greedy ones, and the ones that you see fighting for more money are the ones that already made money but still want more… Fisher And The agents are figthing for their pockets not for the players…

    • Gary says:

      Dumb dumb dumb comments keep coming. They are not giving individual guys half of the cut. 50%(for the sake of argument) doesn’t go to one player. That 50% is divided amongst the team to pay their salary.

      If you look at a business the two main parts an owner pays money to are employee salary and the product they are selling. In this case the players are both! They deserve the 57% they are currently getting.

      Please people read up this stuff, it will open your eyes to what’s happening.

      • MagicFAN says:

        Gary it doesnt matter if it goes to one person or to 400. The point is the division of the total amount of money the company takes in. Do the players take a risk if the star player goes down and fans stop coming to the game? Do they take a pay cut when attendance is down? NO they dont so not to mention the owners provide that stage they play on everynight, and all the expenses that come along with it.

      • Gary says:

        @magic fan let’s divide up the fact estimate for the sake of argument. Ball club makes 100 million a year. 57% goes to pay players. Divided by 15 that and let’s say each guy takes home 3 million. 43% left for the owners other expenses. Now we all know it does’t cost 43 million a year for other expenses so let’s say 25 million goes to that. Owners are mow left with 13 million for their own personal use. Now the buck doesn’t stop there because did we mention that parking is not included in this equation. Drop another couple million in the owners pocket. Players have opted to give back 4% of their own salaries to the owner. See my point?

  85. T-mo says:

    Players are willing to starve this lockout (out of principle that they will not be making enough money) but then they willingly go to another continent to play for less money. That is straight up backwards. If u are willing to play for less somewhere else in the world, why can’t you take the deal that pays you more in your own backyard? I’m in favor of those who suggest boycotting the nba until they realize our demand drives the game (not their supply).

  86. stacy James says:

    I am responding to Mike, Eric Zap, and r Shanks. You sound like school children who’ve had their balls taken away. I love what Pierce is saying. I love what he’s willing to do. If it were just about money, the players would have caved in to any BRI% because then they’d be getting paid. And they aren’t going to get paid this year, and maybe not next year because the League is prepared for a 2 year lock out. People seem to forget this is a Lockout, not a Strike! The owners have created this situation, not the players. Anyone who doesn’t understand that shouldn’t even bother commenting on the situation. In fact the National Elections should work that way as well. There needs to be intelligence and “informative tests” put in place to allow people to say anything, or vote for anything. Over and out! Maybe I’ll see you in Europe Paul. Love ya man!

    • Cameron says:

      Really dude? Tslk sbout iron8c. You need an intelligence test to comment on anything.

      The only people who are whinging like school children who had their balls taken away (pun very much intended) are the players.

      Here’s an idea to the players: Shut the hell up and realise that yes, you are the face of the NBA, but you aren’t the owners. You will never win this fight and you’re arguement is going to go down in flames.

      I’m on the frontline at my work (customer service), do I deserve to get paid more than my CEO? Hell no, I’d get fired if I argued the point!

      • Gary says:

        Don’t go insulting people before you know what your talking about. Players are not or will not be getting paid more than the owners. The BRI is split between players (currently 57%) and owners (43%). So 57% divided amongst 15 guys is like 3% each. The owner takes the 43% and pays bills but after that he’s probably still left with at least 15% of his original 43%( were talking millions here) to pay himself. So in effect a owner is still raking in 5x more dough. Now they want to increase that amount by going 50/50. Players already gave up 4% and they still wanted more! Whose really reedy in that equation? Owners!

  87. Kevin says:

    I am very sadden by this lockout. Been a huge fan since Michael Jordan days. Now I feel betrayed by the game for my loyalty. If there is no season this year I might be gone from the NBA for many years and so will others I know.

  88. Nicholas says:

    I just to take this time to thank the players for being willing to take a huge pay cut to give us another great season to enjoy.
    Its unfortunate that they’re employers (Owners) have taken greed to a whole new level. As a fan I am very proud of the players for giving up more then they should have to bring back the game that we love dearly. If the owners do not budge I fully stand behind the players, even if we have to miss 2 full seasons to get this thing right in a courtroom.

    Nicholas,
    Occupy NBA

    • MagicFAN says:

      Nick if they miss two years there will not be an NBA. At the end of the day the players make a VERY comfortable living playing a childs game. Ask the NHL how missing a season helped ticket sales and TV contracts.
      By the way when you go to work on Monday ask you boss if you can get a 50% pay increase over the next 10 years and that you and all your coworkers would like to have 50% of the revenue that you company produces……Let me know how that works out.

  89. steve says:

    The league and owners should have just agreed to the 51 – 49 split in favour of the players. The players have already given back six percent. The owners have gotten so greedy, it’s a shame. They are not the face of the league the players are. I am very disappointed in Michael Jordan, what a U-turn he has performed, what a hypocrite.

  90. Ismail Ward says:

    I play ice hockey in Spain, so I don’t care.

  91. r shanks says:

    I think all nba players need a reality check. To think your supposed to get 50 percent of what the owner is getting is crazy .you cannot go anywhere in the world make that demand and think youll still have a job be real fellas . Bad things always happen to greedy people.I wont check for them like i usually do after this. I mean if me and everyone else can take acut so can they.

    • MackDaddy says:

      I completely disagree.

      The players had a previous deal in place for 57%. share. Owners cried poor and said they lost over $300 last season combined. Players are prepared to cover that in latest offer. So what do the owners ask for? Not just to cover those losses, but to get an extra BILLION or so just to make sure they make a profit.

      a) what business in the world can go to their employees and say “hey, we lost $300 last year. so what we want in the new deal is about 4-5 times that…. and it comes out of your pocket” ?

      b) what business in the world has guarranteed profits? because if the players signed the last offer from the NBA, it would GUARRANTEE profits for every single owner (directly from the players pockets).

      GREED is word.
      But not by the players, THE OWNERS!!!!
      The players took a huge pay cut and other concessions, but the owners are asking for way to much.
      The players should and will decertify, sue for damages, and win. Any court will first compare to what once was, to what is proposed by the owners and see that they are asking for too much.

      It’s all a matter of perspective, and blight on the American economy and it’s problems as a whole. The minority super rich have too much power. Players aren’t super rich… the owners are. Billionaries pulling the strings here in the NBA and in congress to suit their own greedy goals. To all our detriment.

      • robbay2 says:

        The players dont pay the staff at the basketbally games, the owners do.

        think about that. usher steve is out of a job and the owners are fighting for him.

      • Gary says:

        @Robbay2, neither side is worried about the little guy, but to say owners are fighting for them is pretty hilarious.
        Average NBA player is taking home 5 million a year.
        Average owner 20 million.
        Players agreed to give back 4% to the owners.
        That’s not good enough?

      • Tony says:

        @ Robbay2, do you think the owners’ care for the ushers are great enough to to encourage them to pay them more than minimum wage?

      • Nick says:

        Finally someone who knows what they’re talking about… isn’t it funny everyone is out to blame the players ? Why do people keep saying try asking your boss and stuff like that ? Does anyone on here have a job where someone pays over $100 to come watch them play? Think of this, One the owners are BILLIONAIRES making money not only off owning the team but whatever other buisness they own. Look at how the Sonics old owner sold them because he couldn’t run a basketball team and make a profit off them like he did with Starbucks. Two the players are the only reason they are making money from the team we don’t pay to watch the owners do we? Three the players already were willing to give back about 300 million but the owners are being selfish and want more, so if you want to compare it to a job lets do that , your boss signs a contract with you saying you’re going to make 100,000 a year , oh no wait now they changed their mind and want some money back and tell you you can’t show up to work until I get everything I want and I don’t care what you want. Wouldn’t you sue or find another job too? People really blame the players for wanting to go play overseas?

  92. David says:

    My question is why should we set a division for BRI at all? Just have each team pay players according to the market wage so owners cannot blame anything on the players if they make bad deals. This will solve all system and economic issues and we would have games to watch. Competitive balance will work itself out, besides don’t you think NY and LA should have better players because there are more people watching them?

    On a side note, all you folks who boycott the NBA are not true fans. I will not stop watching the NBA no matter what happens, either labour talks or games. The NBA will never loose me as a fan!

    • Jimmy says:

      LA and NY won’t make any money either if the teams they are playing suck…. well, LA will because their fans are watching each other and not the game, but just about everyone else will lose $. Then we have contraction- more players lose jobs, fans lose teams, etc.

      Competitive balance is good for the league, the fans and the players. The NBA has stated clearly that competitive balance is their primary goal. The players have no clear answer why they are turning down the NBA’s offer other than to say that it’s “unfair.” What about it is unfair. Be more specific. You have agreed on the $ so what about the system is killing this?

      Pride and legacy- Billy Hunter and Derek Fisher don’t want to be the ones that were at the helm when changes like this were made… but the changes will be made, so resign if you can’t stomach it. This is not a bad deal. It is actually a good deal… just not nearly as good as the previous deal. But the NBA has been taking it on the chin for the past 12 years or so and changes need to be made for the sustainability of the league. Even many of the players don’t know why this deal wasn’t submitted for them to vote on it.

      Once again… it is a mater of Pride!

      • Gary says:

        “competitive balance”, has got to be the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard of. You think that if the owners get their way the teams will somehow balance out? All I can say is that there is a little something called 1st round draft pick that for years has disrtibuted star players across some of the lowest teams. Now when a franchise fails to keep that player or doesn’t win a championship. It’s not because they didn’t have “competitive balance”. It’s because the team as a whole just wasn’t capable of doing it. Take Detroit in 04 for instance. They had one star(and not even a very popular one) at the time, Chauncy Billups. Yet they Beat LA which had practically a dream team. Also look at their payroll that year compared to others. It’s not about money. Its about the will of the players to perform for their team. Which usually comes with great coaching. Almost all NBA teams are capable of making a championship run if they work for it. But these stupid owners trade off player so much they never get a chance to develope a good team.

      • Kevin says:

        Gary, I just thought I would mention that often it’s the player that wants to leave. An owner doesn’t always have a choice. Lebron James is a good case in point. Even if an owner offers a great deal players often want to play on teams that already have star talent, which means the draft picks only help out a struggling team for a few years. Even then, the talent they get from the draft has to be developed, and a great player will often leave a team just as they are coming into their own.

    • Tony says:

      That is exactly why there is a split of the BRI. It allocates a portion toward players salary and another portion to owners’ operating expenses/profits. The owners wants a bigger share so that they can have more for themselves and nothing to do with competitive balance because the shift in BRI to the owners cannot be used to pay players’ salaries. They want to move that money from everyone else right into their pockets no different than how business owners do. Except that business owners have a bigger right to do so since they invest their own money more than sports owners do who more times than not have a city put up the capital sxpenditures which is paid back over time through current revenue. Note also that the players didn’t even utilize all the money allocated to their salaries last year.

  93. Allen Jerome Llenes says:

    Boycotting the NBA actually sounds like a good idea but I dont know if I can do that though. I just love the game. Hope they can work this out fast!

  94. Mike says:

    I am a huge NBA fan but at this point I don’t care if they play this year. We as fans should boycott the NBA if they get back. Without fans there is no money to worry about dividing.. I think both sides feel this is an entitlement program. Wait until the money runs dry!

    • Eric Zap says:

      Definitely boycott. Greedy greedy men who don’t deserve my hard earned money.
      Go on and go overseas Paul Pierce and take your whole team with you, completey abandon us, see if we don’t forget it soon. Stay over there. Bye.

      • kappa89 says:

        Very few players make 200,000 per year. The average salasy is 5million bucks. 22million per yer, 19million per year..123 million over 6 years, 112 million over 6 years..Its all relative! How much more money do you need? Arent you tired of seeing the vaerage price of a ticket continue to go up? All these costs are being handed down to us. Enough is enough!

        Cancel the season, i dont care!! In fact, it would be funny if the courts voided all contracts. That would mean that the $100 million dollar club members wouldnt get the rest of their money. if that happened, I bet you would see all these so-called “faces of the league, who have all but disappeared from the negotiations” front and center.

    • Gary says:

      These guys may make millions, but they earned that right by working hard to get in the NBA(most of them). Stop telling them they should be satisfied with what they make. Also it’s not just about the money. Read up and look at some of the restrictions owners are trying for. These guys just want a fair deal.

      • Tony says:

        Exactly. Most peolpe seem blinded by the money aspect not realizing that the players have long now given back 280M and were just trying to ensure they don’t become locked away in the team that draft them.

      • Eric Mayes says:

        fair deal. did you fall off the hay wagon? they all make more money than most of us in 5 years!!!!!! get real GAry

      • Robert says:

        No offense to ya Gary but i have to disagree. While the NBA players have worked hard to get where they are, I dont believe annnnnnybody deserves to be making the amount of money the players today are. The only person who should be making that much money is the person who comes up with the cure for cancer and AIDS haha. Also, if you look at the framework of any other organization whether it be in the business sector or in the health sector, the owners ALWAYS make more money than the employees, what makes the NBA any different. While I dont agree with the concept.. thats life. In my opinion a 50/50 split is exactly what the NBA needs. half the revenue go to the players, and half the revenue goes to the people who *EMPLOY these players. I think this issue has a lot more to do with respect than anything else, owners and teams shouldn’t be corned to a wall just because one of their players is unhappy. If your making 5million over 5 years (which is nothing compared to what they make) I think they should just suck it up and remember that its a hell of a lot better pay then most other professions. Don’t forget these players make tons of money of endorsements and sponsorships.

      • imad akel says:

        I agree with Gary
        The players gave back a lot of money
        At the end of the day, each player would be giving back ~660K annually from his paycheck back to the owners (as a result of going down to 50%)

        If I’m a millionaire, 660K per year matters to me. Especially if my career is one where i’m out of a job at 40 (if i’m lucky to make it that long).

        In other words, if you made 200K per year, would you be willing to give away 10% of that to your employer (on top of taxes)?

        These players agreed. You’d think the least the owners could do in return is let them have favorable working and signing conditions.

      • James says:

        Exactly… People need to stop saying they make more than they should. If they are making more than they deserve then why don’t you do it… Because you can’t … Because you don’t spend the time … u don’t put in the effort.. u don’t take the risks.. and you don’t have the talent that these players do. They are the BEST IN THE WORLD at their craft… that is why they make millions. For the “fans” complaining about them ‘abandoning’ you… get real.. if u were a true fan you would want to see them do what is best for them… and then you have the nerve to call THEM selfish…. hilarious.. THEY are selfish because they don’t want to give back millions of dollars? Its not about them asking for more money.. its about the league trying to take a bigger cut and set things up to favor themselves and not the players or the leauge.

        Good for the players… Stick by your guns fellas. YOU all are the product that is making billions and creating jobs for thousands of people.. including David Stern… so tell them mfs to get their priorities straight.

      • PJ says:

        Yea! Players need more money!! They really do! How selfish of all of you to say that they’re don’t need more. They need the money for their cars! They can’t drive nice cars without lots of money!

        Where have you NBA haters been the last 1

      • PJ says:

        10 years!
        Haven’t you heard of Latrell Sprewell! The poor guy was offered only 10 million a year! How on earth could he afford to pay for his children’s food? He said it himself when he turned down the 10million “I need to feed my kids!”

        And what about poor Antoine Walker?! He deserves at least a small part of the new settlement that the players end up getting. Poor Antoine played 11 seasons, and made over 100million. Thanks to people like you guys who hate on the players for ‘wanting a fair deal’ Antoine is now 10 million in debt. Lots of these players need money for Reno and other casinos. It is a basic need they have. If they don’t have money for their toys, then they are not able to play to the same level and they are also unable to take people along with them on their trips to resorts.

        You people just could never understand that. Just like you people need to eat food, these guys need to have lots of toys. It is just a basic human need! Without their toys, and money we might not even have basketball! Heaven forbid if that should ever happen…. so, please, start now….maybe we can start a donation fund to support their Lawyer fees….

    • Garry says:

      I agree 100%.. This made no sense, it was all about wounded pride. When the NBA struck the first time MJ retired for good and we never found out if the bull’s could done 4 in a row..I didnt watch Pro Basketball again until Lebron James came into the league. So that is means I might do them as I did baseball. (I dont watch baseball anymore)

      • John Doe says:

        I agree 100%. We are commoners, members of the lame group. We don’t see the millions. What do we know about fair deal. Our employers keep on imposing their will on us. With the same token, why don’t you work for half of what you are getting paid, hell no! We cannot sustain! With the same token, these players work hard since 6 years old, working their way to the top. Go ahead and replace these elite players with the D-league players and street ball hoop players and see if the commoners would pay to watch the shows, hell no!

        It’s a fair market. Nobody force us to buy that ticket, season tickets and all. You want to watch it, you pay up. And, please stop asking the surgeon and the hospital to give you a discount. Some half-half trainees may leave a surgical knife in your rear! Take that if you complain about the high paid surgeon.

        You know how much NY Yankees are paying their fat faces! You know how much Tiger the Wood is getting paid for playing with his golf ball which apparently dropped out of his pants. Come on, if you cannot afford it, players play elsewhere and someone will pay to watch!

        Btw, they work of 10 years. How many like Jordon,O’Neil, Mutombo, Millers, Stockton, Malone, Magic, Bird….and on who are the faces of the NBA for decades. How many bench players are making the NBA player minimum. How many years do we get to make money, 30 years. If you recall, there was a NFL player actually declined the offer and kept his day job. That tells you how cut throat the pro sport industry is all about. Go fight the billionaires. They do nothing for the poor people anyway. Do they even care to show up on NBA Cares activities, maybe Mike Cuben only!

    • Tanya says:

      I agree! I’m getting so fed up with the fact that they aren’t playing… They get tons of money, and just because they aren’t getting what they’re used to, they’re still making tons more than the average american. It’s a little selfish. I just want to watch them play, but now that they’re suing the leauge, it’s pathetic…

    • Alex says:

      Mike, I agree, but the NBA might be permanently canceled which I would want to watch basketball before the end of my life.